Tony.T Posted March 11, 2010 Report Share Posted March 11, 2010 Hi everyone- this is not what you might be expecting, so fold back your ears and read.... I've been thinking about this for a few hours- I had a very real and negative experience this afternoon about an hour before I shut. not sure how to deal with this so any advice welcome. Sorry, but this also may appear to be racist- but I assure you it's not. Cut to the chase- A lady of African descent came into the Lab with her Daughter wanting a UK passport Photo. The little Girl was about 6 years old. Both were very well dressed, the Little Girl (LG from now on) was dressed in a local school uniform ( a private school I may add). Took them both to the area were I do Passport Photos. Straightaway Mum was very overpowering, trying to dictate how LG posed. I kept trying to intercede, but Mum was quite aggressive with LG. Eventually I got a photo which ticked all the boxes. But, Mum didn't like it ( as if that matters for heavens sake with a statutory passport photo) Mum then started to get quite physical with LG, trying to physically make her pose. LG started to have a panic attack. At this point I suggested, verbally and lightly physically ( a hand on her arm) that perhaps we would be better off abandoning the shoot. We then tried to do the shoot in the front of the shop (at this stage I needed witnesses) with LG on a chair with a white background card put behind her. Now Mum was manipulating her face and screaming at her to behave, pinching her arm and quite obviously hurting her. LG was totally into a panic attack and was not having anything to do with either of us. I even contemplated calling 999 . Eventually I calmed it down by suggesting that they come back on Saturday when LG had not been to school (perhaps she had had a stressful day) and also my Saturday Lady would be on duty, who is good with kids, would be there. The point I am making is that I believe I witnessed child abuse/bullying, albeit by her Mother. Now, we all know that sometimes doing Child passport photos can be, let's say, somewhat challenging, but this was on a totally different level. The sad thing is that the LG was a sweet little kid but Mum was a very scary threat to her, and if I'm honest, to me. If it was just her and me then we would have had a very meaningful adult conversation, which would probably have meant I would never have to worry about dealing with her again...... Now- if she comes back for a re-run what do I do? Phone the Police? Tell how to F... off? Take photos or a video of them? Off to bed now, hope I don't have bad dreams, but what I witnessed today was not nice, not nice at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilT Posted March 11, 2010 Report Share Posted March 11, 2010 Tony, you MUST report this to CYPS and also if you know the school, contact the Head. I take it you have a copy of the photo of the girl still so that the school or CYPS can ID? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave S Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 The fact you felt strongly enough to take the time to write about the incident you experienced yesterday, to me would say that things were obviously not right there. I think you should speak to someone at child social services and explain what happened and let them decide if they want to take the matter further. There is a fine line between discipline and abuse; I think by the sounds of it, this line was definitely crossed. Hopefully the mother was having a very bad day, and you won't have to experience another episode like that again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kioskguy Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 Some cultures are very over-powering with their children but that's not the way we are and it shouldn't be tolerated in our community. I would email the Headmaster of the school and tell them about your concerns (that way you have a trace for accountability). I wouldn't send any image as I think that would get into a tricky 'grey' area where you may come un-stuck. Suggest the Head comes down and discusses it in the shop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony.T Posted March 12, 2010 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 Thanks for the replies . I'm going to have a think. She's going to come back to try again so I'll know then if her behaviour was a one-off or normal. If it's a one-off I'll forget it- we all have bad days after all. However if I have a re-run of yesterday then for sure I'll be speaking to the Headmaster !st, social services second. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nash Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 when i have little children i do`nt let parents intervene i just let the parent stand behind me and then tell them I`LL CHOOSE the best suitable for a passport. If their not happy with that then i direct them to a photobooth WHY should i waste my time on doing loads of shots? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aks Posted March 12, 2010 Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 Phone the police beforehand, tell them of your concerns. If and when she appears ring again immediateley and they should respond and be able to witness the behaviour. If she behaves like this in public just think what is happening in private. We have had this problem in the past and knowing someone in the police informally is a great help. Whether there is a cultural element or not is irrelevant, abuse is abuse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony.T Posted March 12, 2010 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2010 Phone the police beforehand, tell them of your concerns. If and when she appears ring again immediateley and they should respond and be able to witness the behaviour. If she behaves like this in public just think what is happening in private. We have had this problem in the past and knowing someone in the police informally is a great help. Whether there is a cultural element or not is irrelevant, abuse is abuse. So, you have had the same bad experience I did? What was the outcome for you? My gut feeling is this was a one off, Mum was very apologetic and contrite afterwards. I need more evidence before I start a ball rolling that could be not in everyone's best interest. However, if I see any repeat of what I saw yesterday then I will not hesitate to act. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aks Posted March 13, 2010 Report Share Posted March 13, 2010 In the case that I was referring to it was obvious to us the kids were being badly treated when we were photographing them, we had a word with our policeman contact and the family was known to them. As far as we now know the authorities were already involved but we felt we couldnt ignore it.If this lady had a temper tantrum maybe it was a one off. Some parents are very wound up when trying to get their kids photos took. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philspectrum Posted March 13, 2010 Report Share Posted March 13, 2010 I have followed this thread, and given time and thought before responding. I suspect that many or all of us observe examples of what might be called Bad Parenting on an almost daily basis. Often young, stressed, poorly educated, or intoxicated, thou not always..... We encounter tiny totts being verbally or even physically abused, or at least treated very inapropriately! What is our role as minilab owners? Are we trustees of the individuals photo assets, or does our job description include part time social worker? When we see photos depicting obvious drug use, or bedroom fun do we report or keep quiet? Our industry has been harmed greatly in the past by big media stories of national chain labs reporting students having a little toke, or of news reporters photographing kids bathtime fun. I have witnessed many extreme sexist acts by men if sub-Saharan African decent on their women, and they do seem slow to adopt concidered western thinking in these areas. The best we can do is live by example, and to try not to judge..... If you feel you must act, I like the suggestion of contacting the school direct instead of the police / social services. Refusing service will not help, nor will it allow you to make further judgment. You will have to live with the decision you make, but I think you will make the right choice! We do all have bad days! Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony.T Posted March 16, 2010 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2010 Phil- ace reply You obviously think as I do. As it turned out Mum and Daughter did turn up the following day. They saw my lovely Saturday girl/manager (I don't work Saturdays these days as it is a quiet day). She has a nice way with kids and sure enough there was no problem. Mum came in today (2 working days later) to pick up the photos and said how well her little Girl and my Girl (Kazz) got on, and how quickly and efficiently Kazz took the photo. She also personally apologised to me for her previous behaviour. I think we can all learn something and move on. Situations like this will always occur, best to have a think before the panic button is pressed- but always keep that option to hand if things start to turn really bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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