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Fujifilm DE100 vs. DX100


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Since I have got some experience over the time with both printers and I think it can be helpful for those who has to choose between, there is some info good to know:

1. Print quality - DE100 wins - better uniformity in both lights and shadows, a bit higher optical resolution, overall more typical wet lab look. However the margin is narrow.

2. Print speed - practically same

3. Reliability - point for DE100 - much higher build quality on DE100 - not only for printhead that is designed to last 4-5 times more than DX100 but other essential components are also build for reliability. They are too many aspects and details here but in short you should not expect to have any issues with DE100 up to his designed life span end of 200,000 prints where DX100 barely gets without problem up to 100,000 copies. Also expand life of DE100 above 200K prints is much easier - maintenance and reset software is embedded in to supplied software with the printer. My wild guess is that DE100 will get to 400K with ease.

4. Operating costs - all point goes to DX100 - ink cost is almost twice lees on DX100 compared to DE100. DE100 uses around 10% up to max 15% less ink but the price of cartridge is almost double. Moreover they are number of non OEM good quality inks for DX100 but for DE100 there is only one source other than OEM and the prices are still heavy. Maintenance tank is also more expensive and can not be refurbished nor to be reset as easy as on DX100. 

 

That is it in short. 

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Honestly, forget both printers. Both are not made by Fujifilm, DE100 made by Ricoh and DX100 made by Epson. Instead, get Epson D700 or D800. Way more cheaper tha Fujifilm consumable. If you said DX100 inks is more cheaper than DE100, Epson's ink cheaper than DX100 although they are basically the same just different chip.

Downside is, Epson Order Controller software is crappy compare than Fujifim's but still usable

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Honestly, first of all DE100 is not made by Ricoh, it uses Ricoh heads but that does not mean that is made by Ricoh at all. Second DX100/D700 inks has practically same prices all over the world. Two Japan big corporations will play on dumping prices for same product? This is unthinkable for them. D800 is essentially D700 with more durable printhead, (among some other parts) and yet ..  D800 PH has 3 times less life span vs. Ricoh`s heads used in DE100. The fact is that DE100 is much more well build machine from engineering point of view compared to any of epson`s clones. 

Inkjet business is too complicated to talk it over here, but I'm in it for almost 15 years and I can tell you for sure .. stay away from anything epson build from last 5-10 years. It is not the Epson that it was before.

There is fun fact for you. Fujifilm own one of the major Inkjet printhead manufacturing company, one of the largest ink and colorants manufacturer (FFIC) and world most advance fine  coating process company ... and yet they do not do on there own neither ink, printers nor paper for there dry lab photofinishing business.

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Well, that's depend on where're you live, i used to be Fujifilm shop since 1995, even my father was Fujifilm tech since 1970, we use all Fujifilm minilab, from FA series, to SFA series and now Frontier series, but since Frontier fujilm just like stop developing, their software is good but the latest update was years ago, compare to Noritsu, the EZ software has last years updated. So Our Fujifilm Frontier now uses Noritsu EZ Software since they're the same. Now talking about inkjet, i agree epson printer not last that long, but they're cheap to maintenance. Here in my country Fujifilm support is very pathetic, small office, not available at all cities, and slow respond , compare to epson, here in my country Epson has factory with 15.000 employees, service centre at almost all cities, and resonable parts prices...that nothing compare fujifilm that only has small office .

 

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Service and support is another thing. It may vary by huge margin from country to country and that is why I did not mention it in the comparison.

Anyway my point is that fuji doesn't care about photo fihinishing business from long ago. From around 2000`s when it comes very clear that the film is done.

Soon or a later they will go out from our business as Kodak, Agfa, Konica etc. did before.

 

 

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  • 4 months later...
On 11/30/2020 at 5:32 PM, hivanov said:

Since I have got some experience over the time with both printers and I think it can be helpful for those who has to choose between, there is some info good to know:

1. Print quality - DE100 wins - better uniformity in both lights and shadows, a bit higher optical resolution, overall more typical wet lab look. However the margin is narrow.

2. Print speed - practically same

3. Reliability - point for DE100 - much higher build quality on DE100 - not only for printhead that is designed to last 4-5 times more than DX100 but other essential components are also build for reliability. They are too many aspects and details here but in short you should not expect to have any issues with DE100 up to his designed life span end of 200,000 prints where DX100 barely gets without problem up to 100,000 copies. Also expand life of DE100 above 200K prints is much easier - maintenance and reset software is embedded in to supplied software with the printer. My wild guess is that DE100 will get to 400K with ease.

4. Operating costs - all point goes to DX100 - ink cost is almost twice lees on DX100 compared to DE100. DE100 uses around 10% up to max 15% less ink but the price of cartridge is almost double. Moreover they are number of non OEM good quality inks for DX100 but for DE100 there is only one source other than OEM and the prices are still heavy. Maintenance tank is also more expensive and can not be refurbished nor to be reset as easy as on DX100. 

 

That is it in short. 

hi I'm using d700 now. and i'm looking forward to buy de100 or d800. since the price is almost the same. what kind of issue you are facing from time to time with de 100 ?

and do really 4 colors can match the 6 colors? and how about the color from what you see ion monitor compare to print result?

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Hi...

Series DX and DL, these machines have a serious problem with the yellow paint after several modifications to the head and cleaning unit, they said they solved these problems, but I'm still not sure. DE100 is not yet defined but it seems that the head will only be sold with the motherboard, which will increase in a lot of maintenance. I am doing tests with MS10 and I believe that the DX100 quality with 6 inks is superior.

 

Alves

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DE100 head sold together with head interface board ( not with motherboard as you wrote ) . Fuji DX100 and DE100 print heads sells at similar price. Probably they want to offer competitive price with Epson SL-D800, where used the same print head as on DX-100 . Fuji DX-100 print head - Fuji p.n. FW16GFA17020 ( Epson p.n. FA17020 ) and Fuji DE-100 print head with board - Fuji p.n. FW30GB0100A ( PRINT HEAD KIT ) .

DL printers Fuji did not itself. DL4.. where printers made by Noritsu and DL6.. - made by Epson.

Ricoh head ink drop is smaller, so it is possible better mix ink and get better quality, than on DX-100 with 6 inks. Few my customers had DX-100 and now use DE-100. They all said, that DE-100 print quality is better. One customer uses DX-100 only to make index print. All other printed on DE-100. 

DE-100 can clean one color, so do not need waste ink instead one channel cleaning 6. Ricoh print heads do not dry out. Even after long storage you can print on them. After quarantine had manually clean ( removed from printer ) many Epson print heads. Few of them had to change. No problems with DE-100 heads. After standard cleaning they started to print.

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Yes, ink is very expensive. In UK DX-100 ink is 6 x 45 GBP. If to use not original ink ( Axel color - Italy ) then 6 x 20 GBP.
DE-100 ink 80 x 4 GBP

On DE-100 to print the same picture need less ink, but print costs will be higher. On other hand using DE-100 will get better quality, do not loose ink during head cleaning and do not need change so often print head and especially pump.

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i had a very bad experience with Axel color, the black ink totally fade away from prints after few months. Some costumers came back angry in my studio cause they deleted the files after they printed, so they lost their pictures forever. And very important, the Fujifilm Service don't repair the printhead in warranty if they recognize non-original inks in the tube (they can cause its density is different from original).

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Thank you for share your experience. I'm service engineer, so do not trade ink and do not print pictures. Just wrote prices, which see online. Axel color chemicals for minilabs are quite good. Strange, that ink different. I heard about ink fade when used ink made in China, but didn't hear about Axel.

Did you test Champion Ink? It is well known chemicals maker for minilabs. Is ink quality bad? 

 Yes, Fuji doesn't give warranty if on printer see not original ink. If printer is working then before sending it is possible to fill system with original Fuji ink, but in most cases is bad DX-100 pump, so system can fill only manually. 

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Here at my place

DE100 Printhead cost more than $1.000, and avaibilty not that good, you need to wait several weeks maybe months to get it

DX100 using PH from D700/d800 cost not more than $200, and with hundreds of Epson Centre, you can get it as easy as 123

And when some people says that PH from DX100 fragile, i found myself dead after almost 100k prints and i prints a lot 8x10. The one that fragile is capping unit, and i replace it once a year , it's cheap not more than $50. so when dx100 user experience a lot clogging, it's not the PH , it's the capping station.

DE100 inks cost around $80 x4 = $320

DX100 inks cost around $40 x 6 = $ 240

Epson inks cost around $30 x 6 = $ 180 that's all original inks

As far i know, FUjifilm wants you to pay everything,DE100 & DX100 you need to throw hundreds of dollaras maybe $1000 for the software, meanwhile here Epson throw away free software per printer.

 It doesn't matter which printer is better, as long you customer accept the quality of the printer, which one to choose is which one has lower production cost, easy to maintenance and lower maintenance cost, faster return of investment. 

 

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12 hours ago, Minilab service said:

Thank you for share your experience. I'm service engineer, so do not trade ink and do not print pictures. Just wrote prices, which see online. Axel color chemicals for minilabs are quite good. Strange, that ink different. I heard about ink fade when used ink made in China, but didn't hear about Axel.

Did you test Champion Ink? It is well known chemicals maker for minilabs. Is ink quality bad? 

 Yes, Fuji doesn't give warranty if on printer see not original ink. If printer is working then before sending it is possible to fill system with original Fuji ink, but in most cases is bad DX-100 pump, so system can fill only manually. 

I've tried some non originals brand (i forgot the name) and i always had bad experience. Chips didnt work correctly and dx100 didnt recognize the cartridge, bad inks (the colors were bad, black had a magenta gradient). So i decided to use only originals fujifilm. Honestly i wanna move to epson, cause service center is near my place and i hate fujifilm service. When i had only 1 DX100, during xmas time, i got the infamous ink tube error that stuck the printer. I called the service cause i know they can reset the error remotely with service software, but they said they cannot do anything. I lost a lot of money and costumers. 

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It is easy move from Fuji to Epson. Just on Fuji DX100 load Epson SL-D700 firmware and already have Epson printer. Of course after that need use Epson cartridges, driver and software. Service software the best is to have on your computer. Service software is different for DX-100 and SL-D700.

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Yes i have Service Software now, i had reset the ink tube error some months ago, and i'm still printing normally (actually around 50.000 more prints after the reset). I know DE100 have the service software funcionts integrated with the driver, true? Buyng the Epson DL-700 or or DL-800 they usually give Order Controller software?

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Yes, DE100 has service software on standard system software. Just need enter service mode ( using Xerox password ) .

Epson models are SL-D700 and SL-D800. DL... are Fuji printers made by Noritsu and Epson. SL-D700 is discontinued and Epson doesn't sell this model. Can buy only SL-D800 series printers ( exact model depends on region where it sold ) . Which software supplied with SL-D700 and SL-D800 depends on region. Can get full Order Controller ( can connect few various printers ) , Order Controller LE ( can connect only one SL-D700 and SL-D800 and nothing else ) , or do not get printing software at all.

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16 hours ago, Minilab service said:

Yes the latest minilabs are LP5500R and LP5700R . They are the same LP5500 and LP5700 ( Frontier 550 and 570 ) .

yes with old software, very outdated

here Fujifilm now sells Noritsu Minilab....yes  Noritsu Minilab, not Noritsu Made minilab with Fujifilm Software, imagine Toyota sells Z4 instead Supra...ha ha hah

13 hours ago, Rourke84 said:

Yes i have Service Software now, i had reset the ink tube error some months ago, and i'm still printing normally (actually around 50.000 more prints after the reset). I know DE100 have the service software funcionts integrated with the driver, true? Buyng the Epson DL-700 or or DL-800 they usually give Order Controller software?

Here you can get Order Controller, and Service Software....sometimes when your printer still in warranty, if you get trouble, they just send you a new printer and take the old back. i had that before

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It is funny, that Fuji sells real Noritsu minilabs. On other hand Fuji can't sell anything else. They doesn't make new minilabs. Fuji makes only one dry printer ( DE-100 ) and nothing else.

By the way - MS01 version 10.0 has possibility to connect Noritsu QSS3801G . Probably added, because on some regions sold them. On other hand in UK is different. From local Noritsu dealer also can buy used Fuji minilabs, scanners and dry printers. They also sell Citizen and few other brands.

Fuji everywhere sold minilabs made by Noritsu. All Fuji LP-7xxx minilabs and Fuji DL-4xx dry printers are green painted Noritsu. Different only firmware, software, and ink cartridges ( the same - just different chip and label ) . When I installing these printers and miunilabs I'm installing Noritsu software. After that on dry printers need to use cartridges with Noritsu chips. Fuji stopped cooperation with Noritsu. Then released LP5500R and LP5700R. They are absolutely the same as LP5500 and LP5700 ( Frontier 550 and 570 ) .

Full Order Controller is universal software. There can connect various Epson printers. Can be connected few of them. To Order Controller LE ( light edition ) can be connected only one SL-D700, or SL-D800 printer and nothing else. In some regions Order Controller LE is not free and need to pay extra. Order Controller LE - Epson p.n. C12C932691 and Order Controller ( full ) - p.n. C12C843926 . Software quite expensive - LE costs about 750 USD and full version - about 3000 USD.

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 4/20/2021 at 9:29 PM, Minilab service said:

Yes, ink is very expensive. In UK DX-100 ink is 6 x 45 GBP. If to use not original ink ( Axel color - Italy ) then 6 x 20 GBP.
DE-100 ink 80 x 4 GBP

On DE-100 to print the same picture need less ink, but print costs will be higher. On other hand using DE-100 will get better quality, do not loose ink during head cleaning and do not need change so often print head and especially pump.

and what is the biggest issue with de100?

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